Laura Cook 0:04

Hello and welcome back to Cadet to Career, the podcast series dedicated to the world of opportunity available through Cadet Vocational College. I'm Laura Cook, and in this episode, we'll be getting down to business looking at the BTEC level two and how to get started. We'll take a closer look at what to expect from the point of enrolment and how to get the most out of the learner support provided by the CV College staff. Whether you're listening to this podcast series as a member of a youth organisation, a cadet, an adult volunteer, teacher, parent, or potential employer, I'm glad you can join us again and hope you find all the episodes interesting and useful. Having made the decision to look more closely at the opportunity to earn a BTEC level 2 qualification and remember it's offered free to eligible candidates by Kinet Vocational College, then most people have a list of questions. What's involved? How long will it take? Do I have to attend classes? How do my cadet activities count towards a qualification? They're just a few that we can think of. Well, joining me to answer these and many more questions are CV College Head of Business Development, Richard Allen, head of curriculum, Mitch McGuire, and curriculum manager Melanie Osborne. Welcome to you all. Well, Richard, let's start with an easy one, fairly easy one. I hope it's going to be a good beginning to this podcast. You're the business development team, you're often the first formal contact that new learners have with CV College. So tell me a little bit more about how that journey begins.

Richard Allen 1:48

So, as you say, my team of business development managers are the main points of contact with all the different youth organizations that we work with. And they work alongside the cadet adult volunteers within those organizations to make sure that the offer of the BTEC or the other qualifications that we do are communicated to their staff and their cadets. So we really are the first port of call. And then when we know that we've got a cohort of young people who are of the correct age, the correct background, whatever it be, the eligibility to come onto the level two BTEC specifically, the first step is to do what we call an initial advice and guidance. So every single young person that comes onto that qualification will have had initial advice and guidance presentation. And in that we are discussing eligibility in terms of the funding that's available for those young people. We talk about how it picks up the skills and the experiences that they have developed through their youth organization and how we can use that as a system of recognised prior learning. And that the make the you know that really is the unique selling point of the qualification. What we're trying to do is all those practical skills and experiences actually take that and put that together on a formal qualification that they can add to the C V. So that's what we cover during the IAG.

Laura Cook 3:12

Wonderful. Well, we'll get onto all of that and the importance about what they've learnt on their journey to date and and and how that how that is then uh recorded. But tell me a little bit more about so when they've signed up, the learner agreement, what's it why is that important to both both parties?

Richard Allen 3:28

So the learner agreement is a it's almost a two-way document. It's it's the learner understanding what we commit to them, how we will support them and and you know the methods of support that they've got. But also it's them understanding the commitment to the qualification, the fact that it's been funded for them, that there is the support out there, and therefore, in return for that, what we want is for them to complete the qualification.

Laura Cook 3:51

But it's an important, probably an important then uh realisation for both parties and particularly them. Obviously, they'll have had some experience with whatever wherever they're coming from, but it's good to set your stall out right from the start, then they know that they've got quite a lot of support as well.

Richard Allen 4:07

Yeah, I mean we spend quite a proportion of the initial advice and guidance presentation is dealing with the support that that is on offer, and there are multiple versions of support going from somebody working um purely independently online on our Moodle site, but using the formative exercises and tasks that are in there, going right the way down to one of our staff going out there to actually deliver a a taught session at their units and and there's various different stages in between all of those.

Laura Cook 4:35

Well, let's bring Mitch in. Mitch, head of curriculum, tell me a little bit more about how you sort of come into this process and and and what you're looking for.

Mitch McGuire 4:44

Every qualification needs the theory aspect, that that that's never going to be taken away. And so there's those aspects for learning outcomes. But then there was built pr literally two-thirds of it around a practical aspect. I know we'll talk more about you know better learner pathways for for depending on where people come from, but ultimately that was the main game from it, right? So we've got our theory knowledge like all qualification needs to have, so that we enhance young people's knowledge and we can teach them new skills, but we've also got our practical skills. What are they coming with us with? And then how can we build on that so that they feel that they're on a a learner journey? And so it's then writing that qualification from that point with persons directly, so that we've got, you know, a very fundamental diploma qualification or up to diploma qualification available for people to take forward for for lifelong learning and onto their CVs and stuff.

Laura Cook 5:37

I mean, it sounds like an evolutionary process. In previous podcasts, we've spoken about it's how uh CV College has adapted, um the evolution of it. You've got to then when you say you pull apart, I mean that's that's good that you're constantly evaluating what works, what doesn't, what's changing with the young people coming through. I mean, you've got to adapt.

Mitch McGuire 5:56

Oh, yeah, completely. And what a what a 16-year-old has studied now will be different to what a 16-year-old studied five years ago, and that'll be no different than five years later. So, you know, all these new technologies coming, which maybe a touch leave me behind sometimes, I don't deny, right? But it's that piece, and so education's always evolving, isn't it? If you just take back to the education, you know, 20 years ago, it's completely different to educational concepts now. So the qualification will again have another uh evaluation process in the next 12 months.

Voice Over 6:27

You're listening to the Cadet to Career podcast brought to you by Cadet Vocational College, improving lives through vocational education.

Laura Cook 6:35

Well, let's bring you in um on this conversation as well from your point of view, your curriculum manager. So, from your point of view, what what what what have you made of what we've discussed so far? Have you got anything else to add to this initial kind of process?

Melanie Osbourne 6:49

I think what Mitch has just said, it is a constant development. We cannot stand still with with this qualification. In terms of like the RPL, the organisation's curriculums are always changing to improve for their young people. So we do exactly the same. Um, and we do refresh our resources. Uh, we're doing another version uh currently working on them just to just to keep them up to date more than anything. Um, and like Mitch and I Mitch said, we we work really closely together um in our roles just to make sure we're providing the best uh for our learners from the resources, from the development. We work with Richard, so the learners are getting the correct information from the outset.

Laura Cook 7:32

Yes, great, they're in safe hands clearly. Looking at the individual units now, let's take a little bit of time to kind of look. Um, whoever wants to lead lead this, because you mean it's all I mean, ever all of you have have a point a part to play in this, obviously. But looking a little bit more at the mandatory units, the module choices that might be available. Mitch, do you want to just explain a little bit to me about that and about to anybody listening what they might expect?

Mitch McGuire 7:59

So the qualification has 15 units, so ultimately that that's quite a full range. But that's not unusual inside any vocational BTEC qualification to have a range of opportunities. It has one direct mandatory unit, so we we label that unit one to make it nice and easy, and that's about effective teamwork skills, and I'm sure we'll we'll come back to that uh in a little slightly more detail on how people can make the best use of their time. But ultimately, then we've got from unit two to unit 15. They've run from a full range of the standard sort of communication skills, those leadership skills, the volunteering skills, things that young people are doing and and wish to learn further forward so that they fit inside. But we also then have employability skills, and then we have you know a health and fitness unit and we have a citizenship unit, and it really does depend which youth organization. So I talk about things like learner pathways. If you've got a mandatory unit, which which we'll talk into a bit more detail in a moment, but if you can take that concept of, you know, that's still 14 specialist individualized units, and all of those units, so five of those that they pick on their own learner journey, they're on their own pathway, sit on a certificate at the back. So it's not just the lovely diploma certificate at the front, there's a back certificate that actually lists to them what they studied, all the different categories and what they studied and achieved. And I think that's just as important for young people to recognise that it's that that's going to show to any extra employer, apprenticeship screen, university, college for their education, wherever they may take their journey, that this is the piece that they've looked at.

Laura Cook 9:38

Tell me more about the music units.

Mitch McGuire 9:39

So inside the music units that they're they're labelled 12, 13, and 14. That then it just I don't worry about the numbers where they it's just where it sits in the builder of their qualification. But the concept is there's a unit for, you know, um planning an event, a musical event, then there's a unit on solo music performance, which often and then there's a unit on um actually music ensemble. We are definitely trying to always keep up to speed and and piece that through.

Laura Cook 10:06

Richard, you were nodding just a couple of minutes ago when we were talking about the sort of process and then choosing the modules and all the rest of it, and that very specific depending on where these youngsters might have come from and what they've learned already. Tell me a little bit more about this prior learning and and how how that sort of shapes things, because presumably that's a conversation that you have right from the start.

Richard Allen 10:28

Yeah, absolutely. So with them quite in depth, and we show them how we have mapped elements of their cadet training or their youth organization training into specific units. So we we've always got a a what we would say a standard pathway, but then at the same time, we're able to offer a bit of stretch and challenge and say, Well, you know, if you are a volunteer police cadet, clearly you're going to be working a lot more within your community, so you might want to be doing a citizenship unit. So we're able to advise what's usual, but also the other opportunities that are out there. I think the other thing that I want to come back on to this is that a lot of this is built we've Mitch just said about employability skills, but you know, we really are now trying to show people the worth of this, how they can use it going forward into a career, looking at different career paths that are picked up from things like leadership, communication, teamwork, um, you know, the bedrock of this qualification.

Laura Cook 11:30

So, Mel, can I bring you back in to Mandatory Unit 1? Tell me, if I'm coming to you and I'm starting this, what tips would you have for me on how you complete this unit effectively?

Melanie Osbourne 11:45

Well, the biggest piece of advice really would be to talk to us. Uh, we are here to support you and every step of the way, you know, be it from the outset with Richard and his team or the teaching and learning team, literally keep communication with them and we'll we'll guide you every step of the way. But in terms of when you get down to the assessed work, if you want me to go down that route, take the time to reflect on the experiences that you have had in your youth organization because they're the fundamentals really. Get to grips with the command verbs because that dictates the level of information that we need from you in your answers so that you can pass the question. Some of the other points, um, some of our learners like to use additional resources, and whilst that is okay, there's obviously rules that we have to go with with that. But the biggest piece of advice is use the experiences, reflect on them, and put them in your answers because that proves to the assessor that you really understand each task and and the elements of that question. Yeah, just make sure your answers are clear, proofread them, and and just just take your time really uh to give us all the information that you need. So that's the written detail. Uh the practical, make sure we've got that evidence to hand. We've got some links with with some of our systems, uh, Westminster and Barda, where we can get the RPL in, which makes that process easier. But if you're not in an organisation that uses Westminster or Barda, just pass that RPL to us so that we can update our records. Um, and that just makes completing the assessments that little bit easier for you. But yeah, just probably the biggest time is think about the experiences that you have had and use them in your answers because those experiences are so key, and you've spent the time developing these skills, just evidence it to us.

Laura Cook 13:40

Absolutely. And as an employer, when you're asking at an interview or at any job interview, if you say give an example of such and such, rather than just being able to spiel off a you know an answer that you've probably read in a book, you uh giving that like I have had the experience of doing that.

Melanie Osbourne 13:56

Yeah, yeah, yeah. And that's covered in the assessments as well. So, yeah, but you're right, it's you know, you've got to evidence what you're doing and why you've done it.

Laura Cook 14:04

And these even as teachers, that's something that we do. Absolutely, absolutely, and getting and learning that from the right from a young age and going through that is is an invaluable lesson, Mitch, for life.

Mitch McGuire 14:15

Definitely completely. And I would just say that obviously when I when a learner enrolls and and they've been with Richard's team there, um, and everything's fine and move forward. We do actually contact them within seconds of their enrolment. And one of the things that comes to them within seconds is an email to the email address that they've put on their enrolment saying, click here to validate your email address. So that's a real hinty hint. Okay, and then once that's done, you get another email again within seconds saying, Here's where you go to Moodle. So Moodle is the VLE that we use. Um, and I would say to any learner, connect through to that. Just get that that there are small films on there that kindly Mel has done. There are handouts on there, but that's actually one of the safest places for you to do your assessed work. So if you just would click that in right at the very beginning of your learner journey with us, then ultimately you've got a visual piece. You've got a course, you've got the course for all the things that you've chosen. Primarily first unit one, because that's a mandatory unit, but the rest will appear. And and those links through would just help and support you getting going. One of the biggest things is you don't need to write war and peace with us, right? But you do need to necessarily write more than five words. Yeah. Right. So it's it's getting that balance. Finding that balance. Finding a nice balance, you know, a couple of sentences, but an example to add that. If you're struggling, that's absolutely fine. Or you think this one sentence is really is explaining what you mean by, you know, the theory of communication or one of the aspects of communication as an example, but you putting that in there and saying on this course or inside my detachment or inside the squadron or I led this teaching session just puts it all into perspective.

Richard Allen 16:04

I think that comes back to what Mel was saying as well, is reflecting on real time. What do they actually do? It's something that you've done, and even right at the early stage of initial advice and guidance, we play a game with the young people and say, Okay, well, let's talk about teamwork skills. Which ones do you know before they've started learning? And you can pull it out of them, they'll know. And then from there, we're able to say, Well, okay, they are. You've identified three different teamwork skills. Now, what we're going to do is we're going to get you to describe them and how you use them. So, right the way, we're already starting to get their minds working on okay, it's not just saying I do this, it's how I do it. What you know, what's the evidence to support that?

Laura Cook 16:44

And from your experience, how engaged are they with selling themselves and being able to talk about themselves? Because it is a skill because sometimes you think, oh, I don't want to show off on I don't want to maybe say this or say that. You know, sometimes you think uh selling yourself is is a quite a difficult skill to do properly. Do you find that they have the confidence uh of doing that, or do you have to sort of hone it and pull it out of them?

Richard Allen 17:07

That's a tough question because we will see all ends of the spectrum. Yeah, we will see a very confident young person who are who you is able to talk at all levels. Yeah. But then we will also see people who you know a bit more reticent. So you again, that's something that we're all on hand to do. You know, uh bringing everybody into the you know the chat, as it were.

Melanie Osbourne 17:30

Sure, yes. Just on that, the fact that everybody's different, that's where kind of our qualification, you know, we've got those different assessment methods, so people can attend face-to-face sessions, they can work with their own tutors, they can do it on Moodle, they can do verbal submissions. We we've got such a varied range really to encompass everyone to allow everyone to learn.

Laura Cook 17:54

I guess what I'm trying to sort of trying to establish as well is you know, people if you don't have the confidence, you can have the confidence in you guys that you know everybody, you know, all that that range of people that you were talking about, you you will adapt and and bring out the best of whatever they've they're bringing to you and then whatever they need. Can we go back, Mitch, a little bit, just to make it completely clear? So when they're coming in and they're Richard, they've gone to you and they've they've had the initial um uh advice and guidance, and then we talked about the mandatory unit one. Tell me about then then the journey, because we've got a lot of things going on here. BTEC and then the optional unit three, just a nice little round little bubble, if you could, of what the journey would look like for somebody.

Mitch McGuire 18:38

We asked that all learners do the mandatory unit first, because without that you cannot have a qualification. So by doing the mandatory unit first, uh unit one about effective teamwork sales, it it just means you're you're suddenly on the right path. I think one of the things that we need to recognise is when we were building the curriculum with Pearsons, there are generally, because the odd one has four learning outcomes, but they're generally three learning outcomes. Learning outcome one um is all about the theory size. Well, what theory have we learned before? What theory can I pull back on, or but what theory are we as teachers going to teach you to to express? So I'll come back to that concept. Learning outcome two is we call it RPL, recognized prior learning, but it's actually their practical learning, but it's just that's the education term for it, recognized prior learning. What activities have they taken part in? So we need to understand that. And then learning outcome three is all about their evaluation. What did they reflect on and thing? And it really does depend on the learner individually on how much they need to do all three, two of the three, or even one of the three. So I think that's where the breakdown is. So trying to recognize that there is a theory part, a practical part, and a review evaluation part, and that's all built inside. So, you know, the full title is and personal development, and the whole point of the review evaluation part is that is your own personal development. So that takes it in there. Nine times out of ten, most learners that join with us only have to build up on the theory side of things because they've actually got the practical world.

Laura Cook 20:20

So, Richard, going back to what the learners, what their expectations are from what they're going to get out of this, the original learning aim, the conversations that you have around that and the future of this.

Richard Allen 20:32

So, what we will have with with that young person from the discussions we're having with them at initial advice and guidance, um, based on their experience, the time they've got to um devote to this, we you know, we're very able to turn around and say, Well, we think you should do the diploma. We like people to do the diploma because that's clearly the higher level and the the better qualification. But if somebody isn't able to do that, or they don't think they can fit that into their um busy lives, whether that be their mainstream schooling, social lives, cadet lives, whatever it is, then we're able to turn around and say, Well, we've got the extender certificate. So the extender certificate is only three units, so the mandatory teamwork unit and two others, or the better one to do is the diploma because that's six units, same mandatory unit, teamwork skills, but going on and then doing five optional units. So when they've made that choice and they make that choice right at the outset when they fill out their enrolment form, so that's their original learning aim.

Laura Cook 21:36

Okay, yeah. And in so just giving a little bit more context around the sort of time pressures. I mean, this is very dependent on what they're all going to be doing, but like you've just touched on, they have they have busy lives, they have lots of pressures, they have socialized, they have other things going on in their, you know, in their in their in their backgrounds there. So what sort of if there is a ballpark figure, give me an idea about how long all this. Takes and like we've touched upon classroom or virtual or you know, because that's all important.

Richard Allen 22:04

The one question we're always asked by a cadet how long is this going to take me? It's a very difficult thing to turn around for an individual person and say, uh, you know, a rounded figure. If you have got, and I I I hate using the word, an an average cadet who's got the average amount of experience, generally speaking, they're having to do the written work for about three of the units, possibly four. And dependent on how much recognized prior learning that they've got in that that's picked up as their practical experience depends on how much of the written work. So I might turn around to um a young person, say for unit one, you're going to be studying for somewhere between 45 minutes and an hour and a half, and you're instantly saying, Hang on a minute, that's too that's double. Why? But that then comes back down to that individual. What have they got? How detailed are their answers, how do you know what experience have they got? So you know, it's it's possible to turn around and say to somebody who's got the the average amount of experience that they will be you know, it'll they'll do four units, each of which might take them an hour and a half.

Laura Cook 23:15

Is there any bridging? If if they find that they've gone into the uh maximum amount of learning but then can't necessarily achieve that, or they've gone in for the sort of the not the minimum but the exert certificate. Is there a way of changing and swapping and changing?

Richard Allen 23:41

Yep, definitely. Uh and again, sometimes we might have that conversation and say, well, if you're concerned about workload and how you're going to fit this in, start off with the extended certificate, see how it goes by that time. You'll you'll know whether this is working for you. And if you then want to go on and top up to the diploma, yeah, absolutely. Let us know and we can do that.

Voive Over 24:02

You're listening to the Cadet to Career podcast to get more insight, better learning.

Laura Cook 24:08

So we touched upon employability skills and the importance of how employers are going to see you, how you're going to get into an interview and what you're what you're going to expect. Optional unit three. Mitch, do you want to just explain a little bit about what that includes?

Mitch McGuire 24:21

What skills does the young person actually have that they don't realise? So if you can talk about what our employers are looking for, then look what you already have. So you already have some of what employees are looking for, and how can you evidence that? It then takes them on a bit more of a journey of how can you sell yourself effectively? So, what skills can we do in theory based with yourselves that we can say, right? This is a good way of looking at writing a CV, some different styles. This is a good way of looking at, you know, that job description that you've seen something you like for. Now that could be that could be a course that you want to go on, and it's all got the same personal spec. What are they wanting? But also is the case of what job, what apprenticeship posts there might be, how to fill in an application for me. It might sound quite naive, but you know, if you've not filled one in before, what's the best way of can be done? In which way can you fill this in more effectively? And then once we've gone through that, it goes back on to okay, so now it's interview time. What are we going to do at that interview? Right? Uh, to you know, what questions are you like to be asked? So that there's some practice time with them to consider that. What questions should you always have a couple of questions in your back pocket too? What sort of questions could you ask? How can you pick those out of the job description that you've read or the ad for whatever it is, so that you've got a couple of questions, so that there's a two-way piece.

Laura Cook 25:48

And Mel, that sort of touches upon what we you were you were telling us a bit earlier about the example-led answers, any any tips that you have on anyone completing this unit?

Melanie Osbourne 25:58

Yeah, I mean, so in terms of we teach like the star technique, the situation task, action, and result. So that's really sort of getting to heart of what your experiences are, and and kind of as I think it was Mitch that said, selling yourself at interview so that so you get that relationship with the interviewer. But yeah, it's it's it's a really, really interesting unit, isn't it? And it's kind of got a really good uptake. As part of that unit, we look at a SWOT analysis, really. So, sort of what the strengths are, what the areas for development are, what opportunities they've got, and kind of what threats may face them uh before they get to kind of employment there. So time is spent with the learners and it and it's kind of ri it's just vital, and it and some of the answers that come through are just commendable, aren't they, Mitch? It's just really, really, you know, it's been worthwhile for that learner. Um, so yeah, I'd I'd I'd promote Unit 3 to anyone, really.

Mitch McGuire 26:52

You don't need to study the writing element of Unit 3 to be able to access the Employability Skills Workshop.

Laura Cook 26:59

Right, okay.

Mitch McGuire 27:00

It's available for any learner who is studying the diploma. And the reason we say it's that age is because they're the learners that need that support, maybe. They need to understand what this diploma is doing for them in addition to their own schooling, colleging, whatever, where do they want to go next? But it's the fact that it's available for everybody, we don't stop anybody, it's a free course.

Laura Cook 27:24

So if we're looking at an overall, we can't look at an average, like we've said, Richard, can't look at an average cadet, an average young person, but there there are so many skills that are brought into all of this that then how do we then translate that to an employer looking at them and seeing what these cadets might have in terms of experience? How does how does that all fit together from their journey with you guys through to then possibly getting a job?

Richard Allen 27:49

I think that's where this qualification provides that bridge. Um, these young people have had an amazing experience in their youth organization, they have these skills, but I think there is a degree of not ignorance or misunderstanding out there. Employers don't necessarily know what Cadet Force people do settings. So I think this is what we need to be able to do is to say, well, BTEC is validating that experience that the young people have had, it's giving them something tangible that a potential employer will understand. Because, as Mitch said, on the back of the certificate, it says the modules that they've completed. So, what this is able to do is say, Well, here we are, I've got a BTEC in teamwork and personal developments, I've got skills in teamwork. It's here, this is one of the units, the modules I did. I'm able to show them, and then hopefully, if they've done the employability skills, they've got that experience and to be able to then turn around and sell themselves.

Mitch McGuire 28:46

Yes, absolutely. Mitch. Yeah, no, I agree, and I was just actually thinking back there because um employability skills, sometimes young people don't recognise that they need to know about employability skills because they're they're in the here and now, aren't they? Yeah. And so they may be wanting to go to college, but actually, with studying a level two with us, and and Richard, I like that term, bridging the gap, to be honest, all right, and putting what their Cadet Force element is or their youth organization element is into some tangible piece, that actually could give them access to a level three qualification in education. So it's a double prank, isn't it? And I think that's probably why I think of it as further education opportunities, apprenticeship opportunities, and then employability opportunities. And if you've got a full diplomat level two and you've got some baseline education in GCSEs, and and and generally most people have, then you will get that open door to that level three. Okay, and that level three allows you then to study at an A level sort of thing that may give you an open door to something else.

Melanie Osbourne 29:50

Well, that says it all, doesn't it? Yeah, it's just something different on your C V, and then that's the the opening door, isn't it? We've used terms like it's an open door, it's it's bridge building, it's just seeing something on the the your C V and someone going, tell me about it, and then that young person in that situation can go off and and and sell themselves really.

Laura Cook 30:12

Well, our time is up for this episode. Some really useful practical advice and guidance there for all CV College learners. My thanks to our guests, Richard Allen, Mitch McGuire, and Melanie Osborne, for giving us a valuable insight into how that journey begins and how to get the most out of the BTEC level 2 experience. If you'd like to find out more about CV College and the qualifications on offer, then go to our website at cvcollege.org or you can talk to our learner support services team on 01276 601 701. Alternatively, if you're already in a partner youth organisation, then you can speak to your local VQ officer. If you'd like to take part or suggest topics for us to cover in any future episodes, then just drop us an email to marketing at cvcollege.org. Keep an eye out on our usual social media channels for details of the next episode of Cadet to Career. That'll be available soon via our podcast channel, which you can find on our website, on Spotify, Apple, iTunes, or wherever you listen to your podcasts. The editor was Steve Taylor, and this has been a Create Media production for Cadet Vocational College. Thank you for listening.